25 thoughts on “‘Mad Men’ Series Finale Discussion Thread: Shut the Door; Have a Seat and Let’s Talk.”

1. I’m one of the people who will be complaining about anticlimax. Not that I wanted some huge twist or anything, but the best parts of the finale were with characters whose stories I assumed were wrapped up already. I’m glad Joan’s buyout wasn’t the end of her arc, and but the others who popped up (Betty, Peggy, and Roger) didn’t really need the material that was in the finale (unless you’re one of those–ugh–Peggy/Stan shippers). I was most interested in what happened to Don, and I was just strangely unmoved by what happened to him.

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2. Also, more on Peggy and Stan:
   -To be pro Peggy and Stan is to ignore how much of a real creep he was to her in the beginning. He’s a total jerk, then they have one nice phone conversation and suddenly everybody wants them to be true loves forever? I could forgive him if he went from being a jerk to being Peggy’s work-ally, but luuuurve was too much, Why can’t anyone be happy with a male/female television friendship?
   -I’m also happy that Peggy didn’t accept Joan’s offer. I remember reading a fan theory that Peggy and Joan would start their own company, and the article I was reading correctly pointed out that Peggy and Joan never really got along, which I agree with. But the fact that Peggy and Stan are now together AND Stan wanted her to keep working at McCann AND she’s still his boss is a little creepy to me.
   -Actually, on the whole, I was always rooting for Peggy to end up with someone she didn’t work with, and possibly wasn’t in advertising at all. (BRIAN KRAKOW.) I want to tell the youths of the world that you don’t have to look for a true love only among the people you work with and/or dated in high school, no matter how much television tells you those are the only two places to find love.

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   1. I was wondering what happened to Brian, damn it! The thing with Stan felt like it came out of left field to me, and it was the least satisfying wrap up.

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3. Did you think it was trying to say that Don came up with the coke commercial?

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   1. Becky, it should have been the crying Native American ad! 🙂

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      1. Yes! That would have been amazing. My grandfather doesn’t Luke the show. It’s unrealistic.

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4. I was pleasantly surprised at how many of the main characters we saw in the finale as I also suspected we may have seen our last of Pete, Betty, and Joan. I wanted to see Joan go out on a higher note and she definitely did. For the most part, I was very happy with how everyone ended up, though it would have been nice to see Don actually go back to be with Sally, rather than having it implied via the Coke ad that he goes back to McCann eventually and his life in New York.

   Also, someone on Vox actually did predict the Coke ad and when it happened I literally said “No fucking way” very loudly in the bar I was in. Here’s the article: http://www.vox.com/2015/5/12/8589783/mad-men-finale-predictions

   I am one of the “ugh” Peggy/Stan shippers, and I’ll admit he was a total ass when he was first introduced, but over the seasons since I’ve grown to really love him a lot and he’s proven to be relatively enlightened, at least for the 60’s. And I like their relationship, largely built on bickering but there’s also a nice give and take there that shows they could support one another in important ways. As great as the Brian Krakow character seemed, he was introduced and shuttled aside so swiftly that it’s hard to know if he really made sense for Peggy. She needs someone who understands how important her work is, and Stan is that person. I may be blinded by the beard, but I was very happy with the outcome, overall.

   Favorite episode of all time is still probably “The Suitcase” even though it barely features most of the main cast. I always thought Don and Peggy were the two leads of the show and so it makes sense that one of the finest hours they put together centered on their relationship. This season I might go with “Time and Life” though I need to revisit the stuff from the first part which is a little hazy.

   As far as what it means in the long run, hard to say. I certainly think I’ll treasure it more in the years to come than something more operatic and obviously soap-y like Breaking Bad, but that’s partly because the women’s stories on the show are much better than ones that focus too much on the main male antihero. I’m looking forward to going back over the whole series now and seeing it all again. It’s been a great ride and I’m genuinely sad not to be able to spend more time with these characters. I wish them the best.

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   1. I kind of needed to give it a little time, but I think that episode was terrific. I really enjoyed watching it, like I basically enjoyed watching all of Mad Men. I generally loved everything that we got in New York, and I found the choice to play most of Don’s final scenes with the significant women in his life over the phone pretty fascinating (and they were great scenes). I even found the stuff with Don and Stephanie at that retreat, while not particularly compelling or dramatic, very moving. But I’m actually still not sure how I read the ending. I really dug the ambiguity of it (in fact I think it was kind of brilliant), as far as where we leave Don and that Coke commercial (and whether we’re meant, as Becky mentions, to think that it’s Don’s ad, which would be a big change for how the show handled that kind of thing), but I wasn’t/am not yet sure if I thought the very end was shockingly cynical, moving, or both. Does Don smile, have an epiphany and find some peace in wherever he goes next? Or does the cut from his last smile to the Coke ad mean that he’s basically converted this season’s cross-country walkabout into the equivalent of a brainstorming session and he’s found an even deeper human need that he can use when he returns to McCann to pitch to Coke? Or, if he does go on to some other third act in the Don Draper/Dick Whitman story, is the cut to the ad a joke on all of us about easy it is to turn that kind of epiphany or need for human connection into commerce, and how thin the walls are between the two? Or is it about how even something designed to sell Coke can still express something valuable or real or human?

      In fact, unless Weiner has already done some interview talking about his intentions with that bit, I feel like the Coke commercial is almost Mad Men’s version of The Sopranos’ cut to black. It even comes with its own set of clues to pore over for all the people who will insist there’s a definite answer in the show and a puzzle to be solved (all the references to Don working with Coke, Peggy’s lines in this episode about how McCann would surely take him back, Don’s experience at the retreat, etc.).

      And as ambiguous as I found Don’s story in this episode, I was also surprised by how concrete Peggy’s was. And I think what surprised me the most was the explicitness of their declarations of love for each other. I thought Moss and Ferguson were terrific in the scene, and it was kind of bracing to see two characters on the show just go ahead and express their feelings in such a straightforward manner (and find them reciprocated to boot!). I also almost never feel the “shipping” impulse, and occasionally bristle when I see it happening (I’m generally one of the people using Marisa’s line about wishing people would be happy with a male/female television friendship). But I did hope to see Peggy find some romantic happiness and I thought he was good for her for basically the reasons that she herself expresses in this episode. And I think Marisa is selling the show and the audience short with her “total jerk, then they have one nice phone conversation” characterization for why some audience members liked them together, as well as assuming it means that we’re just ignoring his sexist/boorish behavior earlier in the show. It’s a good story in part because we’ve seen the way Stan and Peggy’s relationship has changed so much over the years. In the season he’s introduced, he’s a jerk to her and calls her a prude and she calls him out on it and humiliates him by being ballsier than him. He’s into her and expresses it in a pretty pathetic and chauvinist manner, but she puts him in his place and he quickly comes to respect her. Then, after five years of a mostly good working relationship and steadily deepening friendship, they’re basically best friends and confidants and then we get to this episode. But I admit I could also be less troubled by it than she was (I was delighted by it, in fact) because I wasn’t really seeing it as a lesson for “the youths of the world,” but as a story about these specific characters. I’m sure I’d hope/advocate in my personal life for the women I know to go for somebody who I had never seen treat them like Stan treats Peggy early on, but I also do like to think that people can mature and change. If Peggy can forgive him (and she did long ago), then I can too.

      As you said in the bullet points up top, it’s a little too fresh to maybe trust that this is how it’ll settle with me, but even before this season I’d have said that Mad Men could be the best television drama I’ve ever seen (and this seasons was just more evidence for the “Pro” column). I’ve watched a lot of the stuff from this new Golden Age of Television, and while I’m sure I’ve missed some of the shows that people put in those kinds of conversations, for me it’s easily just down to this or The Wire (and maybe Freaks & Geeks, though the other two have a breadth that makes it a little unfair).

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      1. This is a good break-down of Peggy and Stan’s relationship. I didn’t care so much about whether they got together, but it doesn’t bother me that they did. Stan respects Peggy in part *because* she smacked him down. Don’t ever bluff to Peggy! She will call you on it! (“Let’s go talk to David right now.”)

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   2. Yeah, I’d read a few things about the Coke ad, including that Vox piece, so I don’t know if that blunted it a little for me, since even only having watched seven episodes of the show in real airing time, I’m already so accustomed to no one’s predictions about the show coming true. Thematically, it makes a lot of sense, and I think the answer to Nathaniel’s question below about it being moving or cynical is the comment-section classic “it can be two things” — but it did feel perhaps more thematic than emotional for me, in part on a pure technical level. Mad Men episodes are almost always beautifully directed, and I’ve become accustomed (as a totally late bandwagon-hopper) to their final shots being evocative AND the music choices being aces. I loved Don’s meditation breaking into a smile, but going straight into Coke ad footage for a solid thirty seconds or so before cutting to black was a little bit of a bummer for me, meaning that the final shot of the show is archival (and, as NW points out below, something the show hasn’t really done much before in terms of bringing in an ultra-famous ad) AND the final music cue is a Coke jingle. Again, probably thematically appropriate. No real quibbles with how it ends Don’s story, which was never going to be open and shut. But slightly disappointing in the pantheon of Mad Men final shots and cues.

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   3. “She needs someone who understands how important her work is, and Stan is that person.”

      It’s just one of my least favorite threads in the show (and it happens with people who other than Peggy–like Joan at the end) that the only people who understand the importance of work/careers are the people who work in advertising, specifically at whatever iteration of Sterling Cooper is happening at the time. I know that Joan and Peggy have to fight to be taken seriously wherever they go, and the people who respect Peggy the most would probably be the ones who work for her and see her in action but it makes me sad depressed for the characters because that’s how things like Peggy and Duck happen.

      Also, Stan never cut off his nipple for Peggy. Just saying.

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      1. Somebody did shout out with great forlornness “What about Ginsberg??” after they kissed so you’re not alone there.

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         1. Did you wind up getting to watch it in a bar? I’d be fascinated to hear how that episode (or Mad Men) in general plays with a crowd (though I’d be too nervous about it being noisy to actually try it out). Though this episode did lack one of my treasured Mad Men hallmarks: the gigantic unexpected laugh.

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            1. I did and it was pretty fun, if distracting at times though people were generally respectful about being quiet (aside from one extremely drunk gentleman who bear-hugged some guy during the climactic moment between Don and the guy in the therapy group, so I’m definitely going to rewatch that part, and probably the whole episode, tonight.) There were a lot of laughs for Roger’s one-liners and a lot of boo-ing for Richard and his general suckage, though I think Joan got the most appreciative response for the night with her cocaine line.

               I watched a few episodes of Breaking Bad there too and I think it works better to see that kind of action-packed, adrenaline rush kind of show with a crowd. Like seeing Mad Max in the theatre, half the fun is how everyone reacts to the batshit crazy they’re seeing. Mad Men is generally so subtle and such a slow burn that I prefer to watch it alone. But no way was I going to miss not watching it live and this was the best option (within walking distance because I’m lazy.)

5. This definitely wasn’t my favorite episode of the season, nevermind the entire run, but I think one reason (among many of the usual suspects in both widespread finale disappointment and widespread misinterpretation of what Mad Men actually is) this finale may not strike some as enormously satisfying is something I’ve loved about the show as I’ve gotten to know it: the short-story feel as opposed to the propulsive narrative feel. Because so many Mad Men episodes can stand alone relatively well — enhanced by your familiarity with the characters, yes, and in some cases very dependent on the show’s history, but not nearly so much as a randomly selected episode of, say, Breaking Bad — there have already been multiple great endings for the show. Hell, the penultimate episode, “The Milk and Honey Route,” ended with Betty going up those goddamn stairs, and then Don sitting at a bus stop after giving away his car. You could have ended the series there. Not every great episode could serve as a de facto series finale, but it’s certainly a show that doesn’t depend on a final episode to sum everything up, because sometimes it can sum things up in a mere 44 minutes or so. Besides “The Suitcase,” as Sara mentions, I especially adore “Commissions and Fees,” with Lane’s demise and Glen driving, “Signal 30” focusing on Pete, “Marriage of Figaro” and “Shoot” from the first season… so many, really. That means the show is competing with itself far more than a lot of others; if you ended Breaking Bad or Lost a few episodes earlier, a lot would be left hanging. Which is not to say people won’t invest a lot in how they felt about this one episode.

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   1. Agreed. I think if you could’ve combined Pete’s story from “Time & Life” (“the king ordered it!”) and “The Milk and Honey Route,” Peggy’s roller-skating and McCann entrance from “Lost Horizon,” and Betty going up the stairs from “The Milk and Honey Route,” it would’ve been the best finale ever, no matter what happened to Don.

      Besides “The Suitcase” and “The Wheel” (the two always-on-top-10-list episodes), I also really liked “Souvenir,” where Don and Betty are in Italy together; “Shut the Door, Have a Seat” for its heist-movie elements (and the beginning of my favorite era on the show, when they first strike off on their own); and “A Day’s Work” because of the Don/Sally moments and “This Will Be Our Year.” Although I might be able to put together a more proper list if I’d seen any of these episodes more than once.

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6. I think it’s SLIGHTLY ambiguous (it is strange to bring their characters into actual history in a way they haven’t done much before — historical stuff happens on this show, but usually with our points of entry observing it and reacting to it, not making it happen) but the implication is the same whether he literally has inserted himself into history or not: the sense of Don relating his own personal story to his ad pitches — which he’s always done (albeit sometimes by lying) but may feel less conflicted and more honest about in the future. Also interesting to return to an actual advertisement for the end of the show, which hasn’t been much of a part of this last season. I may be remembering incorrectly, but I think the last time we see Don really pitch anything is that aborted pitch for Sterling Cooper West, undermining the expectations of Draper knocking everyone out with his smooth talk.

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   1. Also, I’m surprised by how much it doesn’t matter to me whether he did the ad or not. What I found most disappointing about the finale was that it didn’t make me feel anything for Don’s ending. Maybe he went back to New York and made the Coke ad, maybe he stayed a California hippie. Neither gives me an emotional punch in the gut.

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      1. I think I feel the same way. Everyone’s story (except Betty’s) came to a pretty good end (I particularly love Joan’s & Roger’s), but Don’s is like… so?

         I WANT to think that Don came to some kind of inner peace and became a better person, but maybe his ending was inconclusive because he’s the only person in the series who, in the end, couldn’t pull his head out of his own ass long enough to make any real progress, and he’s going to keep on doing the same crap over and over without realizing it.

         Two things, in my mind, make me slightly optimistic for him: first, that he’s not with another woman. Don has always made women into false causes and new starts, and this is the first time he might actually be making a new start with himself. (Though I guess he also gave this a shot during his swimming/journaling/sobering up phase in season 4, before hooking up with Dr. Faye.) The second is in his connection to Leonard, who is an unattractive, uncharismatic man who just happens to feel exactly the way Don does, which Don recognizes. Maybe if Don can realize that he is just a lame little middle aged white man feeling sorry for himself, he can start to appreciate the many people in his life who really do care for him despite his failings.

         At the very least, I hope SNL gives us a Dick Whitman new-age video pitch at some point.

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         1. I read a pretty good analysis that talked about the ending signifying Don accepting that he is both Draper and Whitman — he needn’t be ashamed of either aspect of himself (which is a little sunny and self-accepting considering some of the things he’s done — but then, most of the other characters on the show have done rotten stuff and seem to move past it).

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   2. I was reminded of his talk with Peggy when she asks for a review, and he asks her what she wants next. She talks about doing a huge commercial, creating a famous tag line, etc. And we know, as she does, that he is really asking this for himself. The coke commercial was absolutely HUGE when it first aired (cynical as it was, of course)–so seeing it at the end, after that smile of Don’s, just made me smile–almost in spite of myself. Ultimately, Don is Don. I don’t think he stayed in California…

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      1. Actually, now that I’ve seen this photo that’s going around from @emillersmith on Twitter, it seems pretty clear he did do the Coke ad. The girl on the left is the one at the front desk at Don’s retreat, the one on the right is from the Coke ad.

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7. I like his last conversation with Peggy even better, because he actually admits all of the horrible things he’s been doing the entire season. One of my old coworkers told me that she thought Don as the most moral character on the show, and I had to remind her about all of the infidelity.

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   1. ALSO I’ve been consistently (if slightly) afraid the show would end on a “get out of New York! Start over in California where people are decent!” sort of note and I enjoy any implication that yes, Don’s life in New York could work for him. That he can’t just outrun his unhappiness.

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8. Also, I have to give it up for Meredith. She turned out to be pretty fucking awesome.

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